{"id":2395,"date":"2020-11-12T07:16:55","date_gmt":"2020-11-12T07:16:55","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/winefolio.co.nz\/?p=2395"},"modified":"2020-11-12T07:39:20","modified_gmt":"2020-11-12T07:39:20","slug":"winemaker-series-rod-macivor","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/winefolio.co.nz\/?p=2395","title":{"rendered":"Winemaker series: Rod MacIvor"},"content":{"rendered":"\t\t
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It\u2019s been too long since I\u2019ve been any further north than Waipu; and with the chance to visit The Landing as well, I set myself up with a couple of days checking out the wineries around the Bay of Islands. Asking around, one name came up again and again \u2013 some in the know going so far as to say \u201cwithout Rod, there wouldn\u2019t have been a wine industry in Northland today\u201d. Top of the list then was a visit to Marsden Estate on the outskirts of Kerikeri, to catch up with Rod MacIvor\u2026<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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WineFolio<\/strong>: Thanks for seeing me \u2013 it\u2019s good to get out of Auckland. And I\u2019ve been doing a lot of work just recently \u2013 both tourism and wine. It can be hard work and having to get along with everyone \u2013 which can be tricky sometimes as I always want to be fair and honest\u2026for example, if I don\u2019t like your Chambourcin \u2013 I\u2019ll say \u2019I\u2019m not keen on that\u2019 – but what I will do is want to find something that I do like, and want to praise.<\/p>

Rod MacIvor<\/strong>: Well that\u2019s it isn\u2019t it. You\u2019ve got to be careful. Particularly with wine \u2013 you\u2019ve got to be honest with it. And that\u2019s why I talk about wines like \u2018White Diamond\u2019 because winemakers won\u2019t go near it, and are very sniffy. But it\u2019s made out of grapes. It\u2019s wine. And some people like it. <\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t

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And it\u2019s like Chambo \u2013 I\u2019ve got some winemakers who won\u2019t even taste it. And, look, that\u2019s fine. There\u2019s certain styles of wine that I like and I drink. But I don\u2019t put the wines down that I don\u2019t drink because I don\u2019t like them. It\u2019s just a style I prefer. I\u2019m not a vegetarian, so if I was going out I\u2019d have fish or meat or chicken. If someone\u2019s vegan or vegetarian that\u2019s fantastic.<\/p>

WF<\/strong>: Do you have to keep an eye on the market though, and make what sells?<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: Yeah, you do. There\u2019s definitely styles that you can\u2019t make enough of \u2013 your ros\u00e9 and Pinot Gris, but most winemakers don\u2019t get overly excited about those wines.\u00a0<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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If you look at the Gold Medals at the NZIWS, I\u2019d say 99% of the Golds for ros\u00e9 are for ones made from Pinot Noir. It makes a nice ros\u00e9 but other varieties make nice ros\u00e9 too. From what I\u2019ve seen of ros\u00e9s \u2013 the most important thing for the public is the colour. They want a light ros\u00e9. As long as it doesn\u2019t stick out, within that profile of what a ros\u00e9 should taste like; and normally with a few grams of residual sugar, and it\u2019s the right colour\u2026people like it.<\/p>

WF<\/strong>: Kingsley\u2019s Tastings are back on now and he just poured us a ros\u00e9 that won Double Gold \u2013 and it\u2019s exactly what you just described. Right colour, right taste, bottle looks good, and it\u2019s got a white cap on top.<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: Well the good thing with the judges is that they\u2019re tasting what\u2019s in the glass, not looking at the bottle. But you see people out here at lunchtime, table with nice food on it, and the ros\u00e9 sits there and it lights the table up.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t

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WF<\/strong>: And it lights the food up as well, it\u2019s a great food wine.<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: And it used to be seasonal, only in Summer; but now our sales don\u2019t slow down in Winter.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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What else are we up to \u2013 Pietro<\/strong>, our Italian winemaker who lives in New Zealand \u2013 he\u2019s out the front making a garden bed, and I\u2019ve just made these tables! In two years time this winery will be twice the size\u2026. We\u2019ve just done the roof for another cool room motor which is going in this year, and I\u2019ve just ordered another $100,000 worth of tanks! I have to have them for next harvest \u2013 we\u2019re hundreds of litres up on last year. Things are going nuts \u2013 got all these new tables, but I can\u2019t put them out \u2013 we can\u2019t get the staff. The restaurant is up over 30% which gives us confidence.<\/p>

WF<\/strong>: What do you think about Northland\u2019s profile?<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: It\u2019s terrible. It\u2019s a shocker. Getting wine in Northland into one sentence is bloody tough. What\u2019s happened is \u2013 people like Julian Roberts that whacked the Kauri Cliffs in, or Peter Cooper who put $10 million into a winery there.. and with Eagle\u2019s Nest and what the Duke are doing\u2026 it\u2019s bringing a new level through. People coming from overseas don\u2019t have a perception about Northland. We get a completely different idea.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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Also, a lot of Aucklanders have had a historic connection to Northland with baches and stuff like that. That\u2019s our market in the summer, and all those guys come up here with cars. It\u2019s not like Waiheke where you\u2019re not going to carry a case of wine back with you.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t

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From here they all take it home. With the wineries up here, there\u2019s now a lot of Chambourcin which is a unique thing. Most of the people up here don\u2019t have a problem selling the wine. The problem is having enough wine!<\/p>

We\u2019ve probably got 30 different clients we make wine for. It\u2019s how you sell it \u2013 that\u2019s the hard part, whatever you do now. Trying to sell a Northland wine in Auckland. Say you\u2019ve got a $45 Marsden Black Rocks<\/strong>, and a Villa Maria Barrel Fermented Gisborne Chardonnay<\/strong>, that you know. You go for the one you know. You\u2019re not going to take a punt on a wine you don\u2019t know from an area you don\u2019t know anything about. So it\u2019s really hard for some of the guys to get outside Northland. But at the moment the market is so big in Northland that there\u2019s not a problem selling it.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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We are joined by Pietro, the garden bed manufacturer, and winemaker<\/p>

I\u2019m introduced to Pietro as a \u2018writer, specialising in tourism and wine\u2019, and a lively discussion ensues around who is a go-to writer now for people wanting to find out about wine, including the decline of printed media (much of the talk we won\u2019t publish here).<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: What people want is the stories \u2013 not whether it\u2019s capsicum and cut grass, and they want something they can understand. Bob\u2019s been so good because he tells you the story, but Bob\u2019s not as prolific as he was. There\u2019s probably a hundred programmes on TV about food \u2013 don\u2019t get me started.. but there\u2019s nothing about wine. What publications do you go to \u2013 there\u2019s Michael Coopers\u2019 Wine Annual which is stunning, of course; but half the competitions are gone as well! Even the Bragato which was fantastic for the small guys up here. There were probably five good competitions and now you\u2019ve got the New Zealand International and the Royal Easter Show.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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WF<\/strong>: Or the New World one, but that\u2019s at a certain pricepoint, and if you won an award you\u2019d have to have enough to supply all those supermarkets?<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: We got an award in that, and it was quite a long time ago, and we only had enough to do the minimal amount. So we went round all the suppliers and got all the stuff back, so we could fill it. And then about four months later the stuff starting coming back because they weren\u2019t selling it. So we\u2019d have a shop at Palmerston North that we had to send five cases to, and then five cases would come back. A lot of the shows are about promoting their sales and not the wine industry. I\u2019m onto the Winegrowers Association to try and get the Bragato back. Just have it in Auckland. $80 a bottle to put your bottle in, so they\u2019re not going to lose money. You can get good judges \u2013 Auckland guys so you don\u2019t have to fly them in and put them up. And just go for single vineyards, because for us, a small guy just producing in Northland \u2013 it\u2019s really important for us to lift our profile. One of the ways you can do that is by getting some kind of recognition in competitions.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t

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It\u2019s a bit like New Zealand Savvy \u2013 it only really started to take off when It started to win competitions in England. People said \u2018shit this is good, it\u2019s won that\u2019. If it hadn\u2019t it probably would have taken a lot longer to get the recognition.<\/p>

And with a visit, it\u2019s the experience as well. Monty up at Kaitaia, he used to have that Ninety Mile Red, and the guys would go up surfing and get half a case because it was where they\u2019d been surfing; so they\u2019re taking part of that holiday back with them. It\u2019s the story, not so much the product \u2013 I mean it\u2019s got to stack up \u2013 but it\u2019s the package, the whole thing.<\/p>

New Zealand Winegrowers recognises just how important wine tourism is. They\u2019ve also said that since lockdown, all wine-producing countries are having an increase in domestic wine sales \u2013 so people are drinking more local wine. I don\u2019t know whether it\u2019s psychological or what but we\u2019re drinking more kiwi wine, and Aussies are drinking more Aussie wine. But look at exports for New Zealand \u2013 they\u2019re up 20%!<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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So we\u2019ve got an amazing opportunity, in the next however-long, to showcase Northland and improve that domestic market. It will definitely be this summer. We had our Northland Winegrowers AGM last week and had a really good talk about how we can maximise this opportunity. It\u2019s a big geographic area and as far as tourism goes most of it ends about here because it\u2019s that 3 hour distance from Auckland.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t

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Also, Kerikeri has tripled in size in the last ten years and a lot of those people are retired, so haven\u2019t really been affected too much by what\u2019s happened \u2013 at least financially. Covid made people realise what\u2019s important \u2013 it\u2019s your lifestyle with friends and family. It\u2019s been a wake up call.<\/p>

WF<\/strong>: I don\u2019t wine to fall into that nice to have, but not important, basket though. If you look at who\u2019s important to, say a Frenchman \u2013 so who\u2019s an important French person? And they might say a poet, or a singer, or a chef or a winemaker! You ask a New Zealander and it\u2019s some bloke who climbed a mountain or a rugby player \u2013 those are the most important people. I think life is more than that. I think the pinnacle of life is a poem, a song, a meal or a glass of wine.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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<< At this point Pietro speaks, and says \u201cintangibles<\/em>\u201d >> and Rod and I fall about! Of course it takes someone for who English is not their native language to tell us exactly what we mean! Classic.<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: But you look at the lockdown and how important wine became \u2013 it was the one thing at the end of the day you could treat yourself to. It has become part of our everyday life.<\/p>

WF<\/strong>: How has beer affected wine, because beer is having a renaissance?<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: I love a beer.<\/p>

WF<\/strong>: Isn\u2019t there a danger now that we\u2019ve got craft beer though \u2013 you always want the new thing. You don\u2019t go into a bar that has craft beer and say \u201cI\u2019ll have my usual\u201d \u2013 you always want there to be something new to try? You can have your favourite, but want something new?\u00a0<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t

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I don\u2019t wine to become like that. Someone walks in here and says \u2018oh well I\u2019ve had your Chardonnay, what else have you got? Show me some tricks..\u2019 Do you find that?<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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RM: No, it\u2019s the opposite. People want consistency. Even though you tell people you\u2019re not making a product that\u2019s going to taste the same every year. People want the Black Rocks to taste like the Black Rocks, every year, the same. So you tend to, with those wines, make them within a certain profile. Same with your Pinot Gris.<\/p>

And then we call our Chardonnay \u2018Black Rocks\u2019, so people don\u2019t come and ask for a Chardonnay \u2013 they ask for a \u2018Black Rocks\u2019. There\u2019s lots of wines that have names, so the wine takes on a personality of itself. You have a relationship with that wine. And it\u2019s not necessarily what that variety is \u2013 it\u2019s that bottle. We make a lot of wines of other varietals for other people. And people want to try them, but they\u2019re not necessarily going to be winners. So you\u2019ve got Arneis and Vermentino and Tannats and whatever else. People will experiment but always go back to the styles that they like.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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WF<\/strong>: These 30 other clients \u2013 do you guide them as to what you think you should be doing with it?<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: Most of them dump the grapes off and they want them back in the bottle. <laughs> Some of them we\u2019ll give them the wine before bottling and say \u201cdo you want some residual sugar?\u2019 A lot of people have a sweeter palate so they want a bit of residual sugar in their wines \u2013 especially with ros\u00e9s, Pinot Gris\u2019.<\/p>

WF<\/strong>: What do you think about something like a European person tries a New Zealand wine and they find it sweet, because it\u2019s fruity. And yet it\u2019s dry \u2013 it has no sugar in it. The fruit gives the perception that it seems sweet?<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t

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RM<\/strong>: That\u2019s the national palate though \u2013 we make fruity wines, trying to bring as much of the fruit expression out as we can. In France for example they\u2019re probably trying to make something more approachable to food. We did a tasting of all the barrel wines from around Northland the other day. So we had one wine which was full of Brett. And one young French winemaker, a lady from Kerikeri, and she was halfway round the table, and – I feel guilty about it – she got to the wine and she said \u2018this is lovely, like the forest floor, taste the terroir\u2019 \u2026 and I didn\u2019t mean to embarrass her when I said \u2018that\u2019s so typical\u2019.<\/p>

WF<\/strong>: To a good wine that already has good structure \u2013 those little things, it\u2019s that extra 5% that people talk about. Something else in there that piques your interest even further. As long as it\u2019s not the wine, those tiny details \u2013 the malo, the oak, the less influence, the reductiveness \u2013 it adds some intruige.<\/p>

RM<\/strong>: We had a Chambo that was full of Brett and a french guy from Christchurch, who knew his wines, said \u2018keep sending me that wine\u2019. Because they have it in their wines and that\u2019s the style they are used to. It\u2019s not terroir. We in New Zealand consider it a fault. They consider it a natural part of the product. And then we had one wine here that a little bit of Brett, and that, to me, was a plus to the wine.<\/p>\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t<\/section>\n\t\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

It\u2019s been too long since I\u2019ve been any further north than Waipu; and with the chance to visit The Landing as well, I set myself up with a couple of … <\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":2393,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[7],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-2395","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-interviews-with-nz-winemakers"],"yoast_head":"\nWinemaker series: Rod MacIvor - WineFolio<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/winefolio.co.nz\/?p=2395\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Winemaker series: Rod MacIvor - 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